Update on Itchyboots

[caferider48]

Long ago I came to realize its the rider not the bike. Watched a guy named Rick Vesco ride a 100cc Hodaka to first overall in a 100 mile desert race, beating all the 250s, 400s and 650s. Rick was 6'4" and weighed over 200 lbs.

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

Noraly is an extremely experienced rider, she didn't fail the bike, the bike failed her.

I would not say Noraly is an extremely experienced rider, but I will say that she has been willing to take lessons and learn. She is also fearless, almost to a fault. She only started riding something like 5 years ago and only started traveling 2 1/2 years ago.

 

[60sRetro]

I would not say Noraly is an extremely experienced rider...

If you honestly believe that riding what, 100,000 km+, under those conditions doesn't make her extremely experienced at what she's doing, then, well all I can do is shrug.

How about this, If she stays in Africa for an extended tour, and doesn't upgrade her bike, then give me your address and I'll send you $5.

 

[Roy Gavin]

She stalled it out. That doesn't mean everyone would have stalled it out.

You still didn't answer my question. What bike would you recommend Noraly ride on this African adventure that would be better suited for what and where she is riding taking into consideration her size weight and what she is carrying?

I mean, Charlie and Ewan rode huge GS bikes on their first adventure. They were overloaded. They dropped the bikes a lot. They cracked a frame. Did they make it...yeah, did they have an adventure...yeah, did they have equipment suited for that ride...no.

No, but they had a four man camera crew, two mechanics and a truck load of spares , when they did run into trouble!

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

not trying to be funny here.... but I believe that a Himalayan would be more appropriate for what she is doing than her current bike!

They have about the same HP, but the Himalayan does have more torque. It also weighs 100 lbs more than the Honda.

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

If you honestly believe that riding what, 100,000 km+, under those conditions doesn't make her extremely experienced at what she's doing, then, well all I can do is shrug.

How about this, If she stays in Africa for an extended tour, and doesn't upgrade her bike, then give me your address and I'll send you $5.

I've met and ridden with "extremely" experienced riders. Made me feel less experienced than I am. I guess it is a perspective thing. You believe surviving 100,000 km+ in those conditions makes someone experienced. then I guess, yes they have had experiences. I take that statement extremely experienced as having extreme skillfulness.

This is why I believe she is on the right bike for her. A baja racer would be bored on that bike because of their extreme skill in the sand. A trials rider would be bored on that bike because of their extreme skill going over obstacles. Those are the type of riders that I would say are extremely experienced. You can add in hare scramble racers, motorcross racers, etc. When looked at on a scale where the majority of riders are at one end of the spectrum and professional racers at the other end of the spectrum, Noraly might be somewhere in the 50 percentile.

 

[Roy Gavin]

They have about the same HP, but the Himalayan does have more torque. It also weighs 100 lbs more than the Honda.

My BMW R80 G/SPD has a claimed dry weight of 191 kg, and the Hima feels 30 kg lighter,
So compare at 160 kg claimed dry, for an accurate comparison, and that is not a lot different to the Honda.
Oz has a 200 hp/ton class of Learner Approved Motorcycles, interesting to see how 160 kg claimed dry 60 claimed hp bikes manage to slip under the limit , when their claims are almost double.!

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

My BMW R80 G/SPD has a claimed dry weight of 191 kg, and the Hima feels 30 kg lighter,
So compare at 160 kg claimed dry, for an accurate comparison, and that is not a lot different to the Honda.
Oz has a 200 hp/ton class of Learner Approved Motorcycles, interesting to see how 160 kg claimed dry 60 claimed hp bikes manage to slip under the limit , when their claims are almost double.!

The following numbers are from motorcycle specs.co.nz for the 2014 Honda, and 2018 Himalayan. The zero to 60 time is from cycleworld magazine for both.
The Honda has a wet weight of 320 lbs. The Himalayan has a wet weight of 421 lbs. The power to weight ratio of the Honda is 23 hp / 320 = 0.072 The power to weight ratio of the Himalayan is 24.5 hp / 421 = 0.058. The torque of the Honda is 22@7000 RPMs The torque of the Himalayan is 32@4400 RPMs. Zero to 60 on the Honda is 8.6 seconds. Zero to 60 on the Himalayan is 9.8 seconds.

What does one make of this information? The Honda is every bit as capable as the Himalayan and less weight. I chose the Himalayan because it makes its power lower in the rev range and much more comfortable to ride. That said, I would not do on the Himayalan what I have done on my KLX250S.

 

[60sRetro]

I've met and ridden with "extremely" experienced riders. Made me feel less experienced than I am. I guess it is a perspective thing. You believe surviving 100,000 km+ in those conditions makes someone experienced. then I guess, yes they have had experiences. I take that statement extremely experienced as having extreme skillfulness.

This is why I believe she is on the right bike for her. A baja racer would be bored on that bike because of their extreme skill in the sand. A trials rider would be bored on that bike because of their extreme skill going over obstacles. Those are the type of riders that I would say are extremely experienced. You can add in hare scramble racers, motorcross racers, etc. When looked at on a scale where the majority of riders are at one end of the spectrum and professional racers at the other end of the spectrum, Noraly might be somewhere in the 50 percentile.

Yeah that's why I asked you if you've ever done any long haul overland touring. It ain't racing. It's a completely different kettle of fish. Noraly is very skilful to have survived it unscathed. People who ride in North America or Europe have no clue what it's like to ride in places like India, Central and Southeast Asia, or Africa. Completely different skill and mind set required.

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

Yeah that's why I asked you if you've ever done any long haul overland touring. It ain't racing. It's a completely different kettle of fish. Noraly is very skilful to have survived it unscathed. People who ride in North America or Europe have no clue what it's like to ride in places like India, Central and Southeast Asia, or Africa. Completely different skill and mind set required.

So, are you saying that the riders that I mentioned would be struggling to do what Noraly is doing? LOL! Please provide a link to all your around the world overland tours so I can read about all the skills and experience you have.

 

[60sRetro]

So, are you saying that the riders that I mentioned would be struggling to do what Noraly is doing? LOL! Please provide a link to all your around the world overland tours so I can read about all the skills and experience you have.

You should go out and have your own adventures.

Again, if she makes this a prolonged, multi-country Africa trip, I've got $5 that says she upgrades her ride. She may not, and you'll be up five bucks.

 

[caferider48]

Yeah that's why I asked you if you've ever done any long haul overland touring. It ain't racing. It's a completely different kettle of fish. Noraly is very skilful to have survived it unscathed. People who ride in North America or Europe have no clue what it's like to ride in places like India, Central and Southeast Asia, or Africa. Completely different skill and mind set required.

Even when I ride alone in the San Diego backcountry or desert, I always think about what happens if I break down etc. I can't imagine being in the middle of Bolivia or Namibia by myself no matter how good my bike is. Now I've ridden with others in difficult places, but its never the same as being on your own. In many of these places getting somewhere fast is not in the cards, rather its getting there in one piece.

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

You should go out and have your own adventures.

Again, if she makes this a prolonged, multi-country Africa trip, I've got $5 that says she upgrades her ride. She may not, and you'll be up five bucks.

I've had my adventures. I guess you haven't then. 5 bucks isn't even worth providing my paypal information to you.

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

Even when I ride alone in the San Diego backcountry or desert, I always think about what happens if I break down etc. I can't imagine being in the middle of Bolivia or Namibia by myself no matter how good my bike is. Now I've ridden with others in difficult places, but its never the same as being on your own. In many of these places getting somewhere fast is not in the cards, rather its getting there in one piece.

What amazes me is that Noraly doesn't appear to carry enough food or water to spend a couple days out in the wilderness waiting for a rescue, or a SPOT system for emergencies.

 

[petespace1]

The fact that we are all talking about and getting animated about Noraly's (Itchy Boots) ride videos is a good thing.

Despite our differences in opinion all of us, have to acknowledge what she has achieved and is continuing to achieve is not easy.
That is a fact.

• Noraly rides a bike- fact.
• She is a good rider - fact.
• Is she the best rider ever - depends of what we are comparing? - who knows?
• She rides alone - fact.
• She rode parts of Asia - fact.
• She rode parts of South America- fact. ( till Covid shut it down)
• She rode parts of Europe - fact.
• She is riding parts of Africa - fact.
• She has no entourage - fact.
• She shoots her own videos + does her own editing and posting- fact.
• She also has sponsors and sells stuff - fact.
• Some of her videos are not as good as others - fact (subjective to viewer).
• Every one here can have a view - absolutely.
• Some others may have ridden in more difficult situations, before we had the benefit of modern technology - fact
• Did they do the exactly everything she has done ? - Nope - fact.
• Can we compare historical travels with modern ones - hmm
  
• Then there is 'I know some one who caught a bigger fish' pub talk, and pub talk is good fun - Fact !!!
• I like emojis - fact

... this is IMNSHO - fact.

Okayyy so back to normal programming ...

 

[60sRetro]

I share her preference for solo travel but there is no way I would or could do all that video production work.

It interferes with the now darling.

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

The fact that we are all talking about and getting animated about Noraly's (Itchy Boots) ride videos is a good thing.

Despite our differences in opinion all of us, have to acknowledge what she has achieved and is continuing to achieve is not easy.
That is a fact.

• Noraly rides a bike- fact.
• She is a good rider - fact.
• Is she the best rider ever - depends of what we are comparing? - who knows?
• She rides alone - fact.
• She rode parts of Asia - fact.
• She rode parts of South America- fact. ( till Covid shut it down)
• She rode parts of Europe - fact.
• She is riding parts of Africa - fact.
• She has no entourage - fact.
• She shoots her own videos + does her own editing and posting- fact.
• She also has sponsors and sells stuff - fact.
• Some of her videos are not as good as others - fact (subjective to viewer).
• Every one here can have a view - absolutely.
• Some others may have ridden in more difficult situations, before we had the benefit of modern technology - fact
• Did they do the exactly everything she has done ? - Nope - fact.
• Can we compare historical travels with modern ones - hmm
  
• Then there is 'I know some one who caught a bigger fish' pub talk, and pub talk is good fun - Fact !!!
• I like emojis - fact

... this is IMNSHO - fact.

Okayyy so back to normal programming ...

Very good post.

 

[GaleForceEight]

They have about the same HP, but the Himalayan does have more torque. It also weighs 100 lbs more than the Honda.

Thank you for throwing those figures into the pool of information to think about! If it were just raw power to weight considerations then absolutely the Honda would win every time.

Torque/Weight comparisons:

HImalayan = 32/421 = .076
Honda = 22/320 = .068
So Himalayan has an 11.8% advantage over the Honda

Add an estimated 180lbs of rider and gear on top of the bikes and we get
Himalayan = 32/601 = .053
Honda = 22/500 = .044
So with the weight of rider and equipment added that advantage the Himalayan has over the Honda rises to over 20.4% differential.

Then perhaps we should look at the basic design of the bikes.

The Honda is a trail bike - and I am 100% sure that it would excel over the Himalayan when it is doing what Honda designed it for. Light, nimble.... but then you load it up for adventure touring and that will change the game somewhat! Sure it potentially has a power to weight advantage over the Himalayan if you rev it up to where the power is the whole time. Perfect for a days trail riding, but maybe not quite where you want to be for touring. I have to respect Noraly's arse.... (no NOT LIKE THAT you dirty minded people!!!!) The Honda must be devillishly uncomfortable to tour on compared to the plush cheek-cuddling loveliness of a Himalayan touring seat....

The Himalayan is more of a pack mule. It has the torque lower down the rev range than the Honda so it behaves more like a tractor. Also consider the weight distribution; the Himalayan carries its weight lower so the laden weight handling will be correspondingly better as well since the Honda being so light by comparison when laden it's centre of gravity will be far higher than the Himalayan.

Considering all of the above this is why I still feel that a Himalayan would have been a better choice than the Honda for the riding she is doing.

As has been said before, the Himalayan defies its own statistics in terms of utility. I feel that it is almost "greater than the sum of its parts".

 

[TN_twowheeladdict]

Thank you for throwing those figures into the pool of information to think about! If it were just raw power to weight considerations then absolutely the Honda would win every time.

Torque/Weight comparisons:

HImalayan = 32/421 = .076
Honda = 22/320 = .068
So Himalayan has an 11.8% advantage over the Honda

Add an estimated 180lbs of rider and gear on top of the bikes and we get
Himalayan = 32/601 = .053
Honda = 22/500 = .044
So with the weight of rider and equipment added that advantage the Himalayan has over the Honda rises to over 20.4% differential.

Then perhaps we should look at the basic design of the bikes.

The Honda is a trail bike - and I am 100% sure that it would excel over the Himalayan when it is doing what Honda designed it for. Light, nimble.... but then you load it up for adventure touring and that will change the game somewhat! Sure it potentially has a power to weight advantage over the Himalayan if you rev it up to where the power is the whole time. Perfect for a days trail riding, but maybe not quite where you want to be for touring. I have to respect Noraly's arse.... (no NOT LIKE THAT you dirty minded people!!!!) The Honda must be devillishly uncomfortable to tour on compared to the plush cheek-cuddling loveliness of a Himalayan touring seat....

The Himalayan is more of a pack mule. It has the torque lower down the rev range than the Honda so it behaves more like a tractor. Also consider the weight distribution; the Himalayan carries its weight lower so the laden weight handling will be correspondingly better as well since the Honda being so light by comparison when laden it's centre of gravity will be far higher than the Himalayan.

Considering all of the above this is why I still feel that a Himalayan would have been a better choice than the Honda for the riding she is doing.

As has been said before, the Himalayan defies its own statistics in terms of utility. I feel that it is almost "greater than the sum of its parts".

Where did you get 32 HP for the Himalayan??? The numbers I found show the Honda having the power to weight ratio advantage. I think the Himalayan is a great motorcycle, but the heavier the bike the more muscle it takes to control it in rough situation. I was truly amazed at where the Himalayan took me in the Smoky Mountains.

 

[GaleForceEight]

The following numbers are from motorcycle specs.co.nz for the 2014 Honda, and 2018 Himalayan. The zero to 60 time is from cycleworld magazine for both.
The Honda has a wet weight of 320 lbs. The Himalayan has a wet weight of 421 lbs. The power to weight ratio of the Honda is 23 hp / 320 = 0.072 The power to weight ratio of the Himalayan is 24.5 hp / 421 = 0.058. The torque of the Honda is 22@7000 RPMs The torque of the Himalayan is 32@4400 RPMs. Zero to 60 on the Honda is 8.6 seconds. Zero to 60 on the Himalayan is 9.8 seconds.

What does one make of this information? The Honda is every bit as capable as the Himalayan and less weight. I chose the Himalayan because it makes its power lower in the rev range and much more comfortable to ride. That said, I would not do on the Himayalan what I have done on my KLX250S.

Where did you get 32 HP for the Himalayan??? The numbers I found show the Honda having the power to weight ratio advantage. I think the Himalayan is a great motorcycle, but the heavier the bike the more muscle it takes to control it in rough situation. I was truly amazed at where the Himalayan took me in the Smoky Mountains.

I didn't! I did however get the TORQUE figure from your post which I have quoted above!